Susan Peirce Thompson:
Hey, everyone. It's Susan Peirce Thompson, and welcome to the Weekly Vlog. I'm here with a special guest, first time ever, introducing my beloved mother, Mariah. Mariah Perkins, welcome to the vlog.
Mariah Perkins:
Hi, Susan.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Hi. Thanks for joining me.
Mariah Perkins:
You're very welcome. Thanks for the invitation.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah, yeah. So, you have been on your own food journey, and you've raised me on my food journey, and it strikes me that there's some things we could talk about here, like, for one, about genetics, and environment, and propensity for weight gain, and relationships to food, and mother-daughter dynamics, and all that. What was it like for you raising me and being on your own journey with food and then raising me on my journey with food?
Mariah Perkins:
Golly. Well, you raise a couple of possible topics there. Let me dial back first to the genetics bit. I'm 74. I live near Susan in Rochester, New York. I weigh 108, and I'm 5' tall, and that's about as much as I've ever weighed in my adult life, except for lactating and being pregnant. It really is. So, I don't have a problem with weight, particularly, and I'll get a little bit more to that later.
But I want to talk about genetics first. I had three tall grandparents and one short grandparent, and I had two tall parents. My mother was 5'7", my father was 6'. And all three of those grandparents were tall for their lifestyles. But I had one short grandparent, my father's mother, a Welsh woman, was 5' and plump, and her two sisters were plump, and their mother was plump. Great-grandmother was plump.
So, Susan was born with a father who was 5'9", and, as you know, I was then 5'2". Susan could have easily gone either way, but she also got the fairly short gene. She may have gotten the plump gene. That is a distinct possibility, having also gotten that short gene that correlated. We'll never know. But when Susan was born, she was six pounds, nine ounces, very standard, easy delivery and pregnancy delivery, and childbirth, it was very -
Susan Peirce Thompson:
I was born on my due date.
Mariah Perkins:
Very textbook, born on the due date, natural childbirth, six pounds, nine ounces. And at that time, I was a dutiful hippie, natural foods person, and I was following Adelle Davis's Let's Eat Right to Have Healthy Children. I was taking milk drinks with lecithin and choline in and acetol and extra protein powder and good oils. And I was eating all the vitamins, taking vitamins, and taking the whole grains and the natural foods and all this. My milk came in easily and copiously. I was huge. It was crazy. There was a picture of me squirting milk.
So, we went for the one-week checkup to the doctor, the little country doctor who had helped me with natural childbirth, and Susan, in one week, had gone from six pounds, nine ounces to eight pounds, two ounces. The doctor weighed her twice. He was just astonished. She loved breastfeeding and was very good at it. And in the two-week checkup, she gained another pound. She was now over nine pounds. She was the healthiest, most terrific little baby. She was just a wonderful baby. She made the markers. I won't go on and on, but she was way ahead of all the markers, crawling and walking and talking and all that stuff, standing up. And I was just so pleased that she was this healthy kid.
And we were poor. But there was one thing that I knew as a parent. I did not know how to parent, but there was one thing I knew. I could provide food. I could cook. I could cook and I could provide food, which was an inheritance from my wonderful, wonderful mother, her grandma, who, Susan's related in previous vlogs, really adored her, the only blood grandkid, and the only daughter blood grandkid. Really had Susan's number, thought she was a terrific kid, and kept saying, "We've got to trim her sails. We've got to trim her sails, but isn't she marvelous?"
Anyway, so the problem was I had addictive tendencies toward food. And if Susan said, "No, we've got to go out for pizza. I need spaghetti. I want to go to Just Desserts and get croissants," I couldn't fight it. I would abandon all the good food in the refrigerator and off we'd go. And Susan would get what she needed for her fix. So now I'm dialing back into what it was like to raise her and be a parent of this kid.
Yeah. Susan needed two croissants and extra butter and extra butter for the pasta, and I honestly didn't recognize that as any kind of a problem, because as a kid, I would go to the Dairy Queen and just order half a thick cup of hot fudge and lie in my bed till I was comatose from it, and I would eat my mother's fabulous food and lie face down on my belly afterwards, groaning. My mother didn't have snack foods. We didn't have soda. We had three meals a day. She did desserts. And she struggled, nevertheless, within that with her own weight a little bit. Do you remember, Susan? A little bit. Polly was a little bit plumpy.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
No. Gran Polly struggled with her weight? I don't remember that.
Mariah Perkins:
A little bit. And when she got depressed in her older years, so struggling to try to find the meaning of life in a spiritual practice, she'd turn to chocolate. She'd hide a big chocolate bar behind the novels and stuff like that.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
No!
Mariah Perkins:
She did. She did.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Really?
Mariah Perkins:
Yeah.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
No, I didn't know that. I always picture her making her perfect little meals, one fried egg, one strip of bacon, one little piece of toast with butter judiciously spread. And I always thought she was so moderate with food.
Mariah Perkins:
Pretty much until she wasn't and hid it. And hid it.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Well, that's like you, right?
Mariah Perkins:
I know.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
So moderate until you're not.
Mariah Perkins:
That's right. Yeah, yeah.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
But never going to the crazy lengths that I went to. Never. Not even close. So, which was-
Mariah Perkins:
No, I dare say not. She was not particularly undignified in that sense with food. Whereas I can be. I can rip apart that rotisserie chicken.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Rotisserie chicken. Rotisserie chicken.
Mariah Perkins:
Really do damage. Yeah, I can. And even when I'd go into your room and you'd be going, "Oh," and I'd find that bowl of cookie dough three-fourths eaten under the bed with a spoon in it, turning moldy, even then I didn't necessarily detect a problem, just kids. I gave a lot of latitude. But the tendencies were there at an early age. You loved food. You did food.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
For sure. For sure. Yeah. So interesting. I mean, I see ways that we're similar with food with our little hankerings. And then one major way we've always been different, is you have always, and I've so admired this and wished I'd had it, you have always had the stop button. You eat up to a certain point, and then your satiety kicks in, your fullness kicks in, and you stop eating. Or if you overdo a little bit, you'll then naturally not eat for a while. You'll just be like, "Oh, well, I ate a big something at 10:00 AM, so now I'm going to eat hardly anything for the rest of the day." And I think that's how you have naturally never gained any weight to speak of.
Mariah Perkins:
Much weight to speak of. Okay, I accept that. That's pretty accurate.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah. Whereas as soon as I start eating too much, I'm eating way too much, and then I'm eating way too much again very quickly and again and again. And so, my weight can just absolutely run away with me. It's so interesting. And your Susceptibility Score , you've taken the quiz, I assume more than once, and you're a curious case. Do you want to tell us about your Susceptibility Score and what you know about it?
Mariah Perkins:
I'd be delighted to. And a little backstory there as well. So, I've always had food as a concept in my mind. I've never ignored food and just eaten a meal and gone on with my life. I've always had food in the background of my life. And when you came to Gary and me, my husband and me, in 2003 and said that you had found a 12-step program for food and were interested in doing that, I perked up my ears. Can I go there and just say quickly about that?
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah.
Mariah Perkins:
Yeah. And both my husband and I said, "Okay, we are interested in that." We both came out of the closet and realized that we felt not a hundred percent clean with our food just as a concept and as a reality. So, I think three weeks after you, we jumped into a 12-step program for food. My husband stayed in it for nine years, I guess I shouldn't break his anonymity except he says I can, he does say I can, sorry, and lost a ton of weight. I stayed three-and-a-half years, squeaky clean from day one, so that's where you credit my ability to have some restraint around food, until I decided that my story just wasn't similar enough to enough people to stay in it.
I left the program, and from the day that I left the program till today, I've probably gained back... I was probably 102 or 103 in those days. I've gained back five pounds and I've lost two inches. So that's not nothing in terms of the little indiscretions here and there that have gone on, gone on, gone on, gone on, gone on. So Bright Line Eating got established. I was thrilled. I thought it was just terrific. And I jumped in, I guess it was your second Boot Camp, the one that had the videos, jumped right in, and took the Susceptibility Quiz and really struggled how to answer the questions. I possibly am not a fully honest person in some ways, and that Susceptibility Quiz really required of me an honesty that I couldn't see or that didn't exist because I just go from this to that or that to this pretty frequently -
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Or maybe you have different Parts that see it different ways. Maybe you have a part of you that sees it of, "Oh, yeah, we're thinking about food way too much around here, and we rip into that rotisserie chicken and lose control, and this is a problem, and we need to rein it in," and then another part of you that's like, "Hey, now, look at the ways that people are different with food. When I rip into the rotisserie chicken, what am I really eating?"
Mariah Perkins:
"Come on. Yeah, you know better than that."
Susan Peirce Thompson:
I mean, really, because talked about this, right? It's not a binge. It's like it's got that feeling of out-of-controlness, and maybe you're eating it quickly, but you're not eating actually a larger amount of food than a typical eater would eat at a typical sitting. You're just eating it kind of fast and feeling kind of furtive about it, which does not meet the clinical... So, you have this other part that's like, "Settle down. This isn't a big deal. Really, we're pretty much in control of our food." Does that sound right? Maybe it's different parts.
Mariah Perkins:
Absolutely does. It absolutely does. Different parts identifying different ways of looking at it. Yeah, yeah.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
So, you could be like a three or an eight. Have you taken the quiz different times with those different Parts?
Mariah Perkins:
I have. That's exactly right. I think I was never a three. I think I was maybe a four. And then at times, at my most despairing, I would be an eight. That's right. That's exactly right.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah, so interesting. I was thinking about it. As I was preparing to ask you to maybe shoot this vlog, I was imagining, I think you're a six.
Mariah Perkins:
We'll split the difference. I love it.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
We'll split the difference. I think you're a six. I mean, yeah, from that perspective of the challenges are there, and then also just not as extreme as it really could look. I think the questions are kind of hard to answer if you see it different ways. Yeah.
Mariah Perkins:
So, one reason I accepted to shoot this vlog with you, it would be so delightful to do that, and if I could be helpful to anybody that would be great, was that I thought it would be an occasion for me to just tell my honesty the way you do. So, the reason that I got to 108 lately is that just I feel like I'm in a place in my life where I'm needing to reclaim some of my power and my capacity and my honesty about what I really want to be doing with my hours in my days.
I am being a little too distracted too much and a little too uncertain. And I feel that I also have a place right now to be able to reclaim that. But food is in the way. Food is really in the way. I've almost been letting it escalate, that's how I got to 108 right now, over the last two, three, four, five weeks, little by little by little, perhaps in order to force myself into a crisis where I'd have to deal with something. And not long ago I was saying, "I just can't devote myself to a food program again. I just don't feel that I have that level of commitment. What am I going to do? What am I going to do? What is a really easy quality food program that's not going to require too much commitment? Maybe I can just jump in and grab a sponsor and work the steps around food."
I'm not sure I've ever actually worked the steps just around food, as odd as that sounds. But wouldn't that be useful? And I was dithering about that. "Oh, God, can I?" And out came your book. Out came your book. And you most graciously sent it to me without telling me you were going to send it to me. And my husband's off windsurfing for a couple of weeks. So, I was the one checking the mail, and there was your handwriting on this envelope. "What could this be?" I didn't think, but I knew you had just come out with this. Moi, her mother, thinks this is really a rather terrific volume, I have to say, I really do. And I came in, I opened it with great alacrity. It was October 3rd, Befriend the Body, and I wrote, "2003, Day one," whoops, on here-
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Look at that!
Mariah Perkins:
... on mine. And the next day, a little underlining. And I still didn't join some food program, or go to a meeting. And then October 5th, The Four Questions, and October 6th, Motive Matters.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah.
Mariah Perkins:
This book suddenly started to address exactly what I needed to be thinking about and come honest about. So, one of the things that I do, I have a little organizer in my life, is I make lots and lots of lists. This is actually an old list. I didn't make it for this vlog. This is one January 20th, '23. These are all the foods with a little bit of GERD without the R that I shouldn't be eating. These are all the foods that I can be eating. This is one of a hundred lists I've made in my life.
Good for my belly. Here's another list. Here's a more recent list. If I ate these proteins seven days in a week, two meals in a day where I'm going to be eating solid proteins, I eat my grains in the morning, but here's my 14 meals, how would I break up my proteins, and then veg? And the rest of it's pretty easy. So, I'm thinking about all these things all the time. And your book came out about the four things to ask yourself, and I began to focus on that way of looking at it, that way of looking at it. I will honestly inventory what foods bring me peace.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah, right. So, the four questions, for anyone out there who doesn't know, it's a way of examining the foods that you're eating and deciding for yourself whether they're serving you, whether they're working for you. And the four questions are: do I have peace around it? Is it healthy? Is it messing with my weight? And is it escalating? Is it escalating? Am I eating more and more of it, feeling like a day wouldn't be a good day without it? That kind of thing. Is it escalating? And so, you went back over your food lists with those questions in mind?
Mariah Perkins:
Exactly. With those questions in mind, I honed down those lists, and factoring in this new willingness to be honest more about it. And I had to cross a few of those basic things off.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Wow. Wow. So, Mom, what you're saying is basically you've done food recovery of various sorts, including 12-Step, including Bright Line Eating in the past. You were plagued lately by wondering, "What am I going to do about this?" I love how you said your motivation was you want to bring your gifts more fully to the world. You really want a level of clarity and on point, on purposeness in your life. And you noticed that food was getting in the way of that. And so, it's not the weight, it's the mindset. It's the mental trip. And it's, you just-
Mariah Perkins:
All the way.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
You feel the chatter there, and you just want that gone so you can be your best self. You're of tremendous service. I don't know really anyone who's of more service than you. I just want to say. I mean, I could toot your horn here pretty intensely. I mean, the people that you serve, the gatherings you have at your house, the refugees that you're tending to, not just in a superficial way, but really driving them to their appointments and making sure that they're getting their paperwork completed that they can't read and understand, and taking people who need a place to live into your home, so they have shelter. I mean, you're incredible. And the world is better off if you're not thinking about what you've eaten or not eaten what you're going to eat. I mean, that's just a flat-out waste of your spiritual service orientation.
So, what you're saying is that this book arrived, and given your background, you're able to use the daily reader, On This Bright Day, just to... And just everyone knows, we didn't talk about this in advance. This is not something, a sales-
Mariah Perkins:
It's not a setup.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
This is literally-
Mariah Perkins:
Not a sales [inaudible 00:20:26].
Susan Peirce Thompson:
... I'm just finding this out now. You're using this book to create your clarity around your food right now, just one day at a time. It's giving you the nourishment you need to stay on track.
Mariah Perkins:
I truly am. These things happen.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Oh.
Mariah Perkins:
Oh.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
And you wrote your little, "Day one," on October 3rd.
Mariah Perkins:
I sure did.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
That's so-
Mariah Perkins:
Next year I'll see it again.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
That's the beauty of a daily reader. Next year you'll see it again.
Mariah Perkins:
Yeah. Yeah. Daily readers are really a huge part of my journey. I read. I learn from reading as well as from listening and interacting and praying and all the rest of it.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
So, this book is going to be published October 24th. Can you think of anyone you might give it to in your life? Are you going to get an extra copy or two?
Mariah Perkins:
Yeah, yeah. Now that you say that, sure, let me give that some solid thought. Multiple people, I'm sure.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah, yeah. So as this vlog comes out literally tomorrow, Thursday, where are we, smack in the middle of October, the Food Freedom videos are going to be released. And you did 12-step food stuff with me long ago without knowing the science behind it. And then at some point, I'm guessing you watched those videos. I don't even know. Did you ever watch those videos?
Mariah Perkins:
Absolutely. Absolutely. I'm fascinated by your science. To me, that's a huge part of your credibility, and also just understanding oneself.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah, right. So, the videos are coming out. We're going to do another Food Freedom Fall Festivities like we always do sometime in the fall here. Those videos are free, and people can share them. And then bootcamp registration will start again, and people can start to register for the Boot Camp, and we'll get started here.
Mariah Perkins:
I wish they do.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
So sweet. Mama, my sweet, beloved mama.
Mariah Perkins:
Sweetie, Susan, Sudi, Wudi, Woo, all four nicknames. Which one do I use?
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Yeah, yeah. Sudi. We use Sudi.
Mariah Perkins:
Sudi. Sudi. Yeah.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Anything else you want to share with everyone before we say-
Mariah Perkins:
Oh, I'm so with this community in heart and soul. Just all the great, great blessings of a good life to everyone.
Susan Peirce Thompson:
Well said, Mom. And that's the weekly vlog. Love you all so much. Bye, now. Oh, wow, that was fun.
Mariah Perkins:
Did we do it?
Susan Peirce Thompson:
We did it. We did it. Well done. As long as the damn thing recorded. I hope it did.
